tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post6634128842612830600..comments2023-11-03T05:46:44.728-04:00Comments on RevGalBlogPals: Wednesday Festival: Pastoral Counselor or Spiritual Director?Stephanie Anthony/She Revhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10089531643725874239noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-59211567460037625902011-06-09T15:35:59.779-04:002011-06-09T15:35:59.779-04:00I'm very fortunate to have access to a spiritu...I'm very fortunate to have access to a spiritual direction program that works on a suggested donation basis -- in my case, #10 per monthly session. (A kind benefactor endowed an Episcopal church in my area with the money for a spiritual institute that supports spiritual direction for interested individuals and also hosts classes in various spirituality topics.) You may be able to find a similar setup in your area/region. (My SD is a half-hour away from me.)LutheranChikhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02685566332651377907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-81841004628085532952011-06-08T21:43:11.184-04:002011-06-08T21:43:11.184-04:00Wounded and Healing, blessings to you on the journ...Wounded and Healing, blessings to you on the journey. And to everyone, thanks for the discussion. Just last week I made an appointment to begin spiritual direction (again). Now I'm even more excited to get started than I was before!Joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08856102898980354423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-27582481319489252192011-06-08T20:58:20.471-04:002011-06-08T20:58:20.471-04:00I would recommend a book also called Second-Guessi...I would recommend a book also called Second-Guessing God by Brian Jones. It helped me through a period of spiritual depression and doubts about my calling. I read it in community.<br /><br />The other book I'll recommend (I am only about a month into it) is a book called "Shepherd's Balm" (http://www.shepherdsbalm.com/) it's intent is to offer encouragement for the pastor/shepherd on Monday morning when things are at the lowest emotionally and spiritually after a busy weekend. I read it on Sunday evenings to rejuvenate me for the week ahead.<br /><br />Praying God's peace for you...Debhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12169805543154662247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-30106578998094495322011-06-08T20:52:41.042-04:002011-06-08T20:52:41.042-04:00Kudos for the courage to say "I need help&quo...Kudos for the courage to say "I need help" because so many do not want to admit it... I am seeing a Spiritual Director and her support and insightful questions have helped me face down a couple of major dragons in my life.<br /><br />If you have ANY kind of denominational support, I would encourage you to talk with someone there as well. They may have insights that you are able (and ready) to here after some distance and healing. No view of a situation is 100% accurate, but I found (for me) that retracing my vocational steps and going back to talk things through was very healing. I went WITH SUPPORT so that someone could validate my memories of the situation.<br /><br />May the ministering love of the Holy Spirit surround you as only She can.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-69510969318932680232011-06-08T17:35:33.701-04:002011-06-08T17:35:33.701-04:00Thank you so much for your comments, everyone! I g...Thank you so much for your comments, everyone! I greatly appreciate your input!Wounded and Healinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17442707317362036427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-25370485094508176042011-06-08T15:42:56.333-04:002011-06-08T15:42:56.333-04:00I saw a counselor for a few years who happened to ...I saw a counselor for a few years who happened to be a former RCC priest. He was great at understanding some of the stressors that my vocation contributed to. <br /><br />Having said that, there was a time in our work together when he began bringing God up an awful lot, which felt to me like SD and not what I needed in that moment. (I have nothing but the utmost respect for SD, it just wasn't what I needed in those particular 50 minutes).<br /><br />I remember telling him that God had a claim on me more than 50 hours a week, but that in that one hour, I wanted top billing. It marked a turning point in our work, for the better.<br /><br />I like the idea of you finding and utilizing a circle of care, that might include counseling to get you over this hump, SD for the long haul, and understanding friends and colleagues for the day-to-day stuff of life.<br /><br />Blessings! Realizing that you need to reach out is often the hardest step for us clergy to take.Juleshttp://winsomelearnsome.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-65571241778050500392011-06-08T13:40:30.934-04:002011-06-08T13:40:30.934-04:00Sue, I often think of that book! I recently found ...Sue, I often think of that book! I recently found and am following him on Twitter, where he is @kirkbyronjones.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08235049965406944684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-82032789467572819742011-06-08T11:51:39.494-04:002011-06-08T11:51:39.494-04:00Purple: Dr. Stairs is the principal of Queen's...Purple: Dr. Stairs is the principal of Queen's Theological College where I got my MDiv. She was my field education director and is wonderful as well as being very wise. <br /><br />Good call on that book! Actually, I just spotted it on my shelf after I read your post and thought "Must read that one again." :)<br /><br />The other book I would highly recommend is one that Songbird told me about years ago. It's called "Rest in the Storm" by Kirk Byron Jones.Suehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03407981987874669303noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-83330495485121060672011-06-08T11:42:43.067-04:002011-06-08T11:42:43.067-04:00A great resource: "Listening for the Soul: P...A great resource: "Listening for the Soul: Pastoral Care and Spiritual Direction" by Jean Stairs.Elaine (aka...Purple) https://www.blogger.com/profile/09439199680556347830noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-16899682809496164962011-06-08T11:10:22.726-04:002011-06-08T11:10:22.726-04:00What a great discussion. Thanks to everyone for p...What a great discussion. Thanks to everyone for participating...wonderful information here.Mary Bethhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02970052534402740820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-15845099950677598942011-06-08T10:31:50.377-04:002011-06-08T10:31:50.377-04:00Full disclosure: my husband is a pastoral counselo...Full disclosure: my husband is a pastoral counselor. I am a priest who is currently in spiritual direction with a wonderful SD and who participates in a colleague group which is facilitated by a trained therapist.<br /><br />It seems that either option would provide you some support and healing as you recover from what sounds like a very painful time in your life. <br /><br />That said, they provide two somewhat different and ultimately complementary ways to the "cure of the soul."<br /><br />Pastoral counseling generally follows a clinical therapeutic model, with one's spiritual life and relationship to God as a part of that therapeutic conversation. Those who are pastoral counselors usually meet clients where they are - that is, the focus on the spiritual life of the person is really driven by how much the person wants to have that as part of the conversation. This is in contrast to spiritual direction, where the very nature of the work assumes that the focus will be on one's relationship with God. I love Robin's comment about SD not being about problem solving or life coaching, but about hearing God's voice or opening oneself to hearing God's voice. Pastoral counseling may evolve into problem solving or coaching in some cases; it may focus on understanding what got a person to this point in their lives and where they feel stuck (perhaps family of origin issues, culture context, hopes and dreams met and unmet); it may be deep analysis or short-term crisis management. As I said, it usually follows a clinical therapeutic model. Most pastoral counseling agencies offer a sliding scale, as do many of the spiritual directors I know.<br /><br />Do not be afraid to ask what kinds of sliding scales a practitioner offers.<br /><br />YMMV on this, but for me, I found SD to be a joy and my ongoing accountability for maintaining my dialogue with God. Pastoral counseling or other therapy was a tool when I felt broken or stuck and needed to unpack what was happening in a way that respected my understanding of my relationship with God as well as my relationship with the folks around me. <br /><br />$$? Around my neck of the woods, SDs ask for $20-35 but will sometimes waive the fee. Pastoral counselors around here work on sliding scales based on clients' income, and the low end is usually $30 an hour, but some will waive in special circumstances. If there is a pastoral counseling agency in your area that has a residency program for PCs in training, often the resident fees are lower, and they are under the supervision of the senior folks, so they do quality work. Don't be shy about asking for a fee break if you need one.<br /><br />Hope this is helpful! You're in my prayers as you walk back to a place of peaceful heart.mibi52/ The Rev. Dr. Mary Brennan Thorpehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02129758906278501568noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-4962520870247403292011-06-08T10:31:27.332-04:002011-06-08T10:31:27.332-04:00Wounded and Healing, in the best of all possible w...Wounded and Healing, in the best of all possible worlds, the broadest combination of healing support helps the most--a circle of good friends who understand and love you, a trusted colleague who knows the craziness possible in the churches and chaplaincies that make up our world, a spiritual director who can walk along side you, and a pastoral counselor or therapist who can work with you in healing you from the trauma your first call inflicted.<br /><br />It sounds to me like you are already taking many important steps in the healing process and understand the importance of healing work on many fronts.<br /><br />Blessings and prayers.RevAllihttp://revalli@wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-32755917115876259152011-06-08T09:57:32.443-04:002011-06-08T09:57:32.443-04:00I've gone with Spiritual Directors in the past...I've gone with Spiritual Directors in the past, as well as a good Cognitive Behavioural Therapist. The combination brought together beautifully the spiritual and the practical. <br /><br />The SD reminded me to ask (constantly) "Where is God in this? and perhaps more importantly "What is God's will for you in this?"<br /><br />The CBT psychologist asked more pragmatic questions. For example, as I read through your last weekend, I couldn't help but wonder if it is a requirement of your call that you be "on call" (which I'm thinking is hospital duty). If so, not much you can do.<br /><br />On the other hand, we have volunteer clergy from the community who take call on weekends for the hospital chaplains so that they can have the weekend free. <br /><br />One of the first thing my CBT therapist suggested was that I take myself off that list immediately. "Others can cover for now. At some point, you can go back - but right now - you need to look after your own needs."<br /><br />Both reminded me of that old saying, "If I don't take care of Me, I'm not going to be much good for We."Suehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03407981987874669303noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-41091833851005034672011-06-08T09:48:53.487-04:002011-06-08T09:48:53.487-04:00I echo the above. Not every spiritual director cha...I echo the above. Not every spiritual director charges. None of the three that I have journeyed with have. It seems it may be helpful to utilize both a spiritual director and a pastoral counselor since their functions differ so much. Blessings as you continue to take care of yourself.Ivyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05132396587581088115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-2987033921310712242011-06-08T07:29:07.342-04:002011-06-08T07:29:07.342-04:00I second, third,and fourth...what Robin said.
I, ...I second, third,and fourth...what Robin said.<br /><br />I, too have been the recipient of a sliding scale for spiritual direction and provide the same for my directees as well.<br /><br />SD has helped me see more clearly the places where I have intentionally blocked the Spirit and it has helped me to be more compassionate. <br /><br />I was trained in the contemplative method and it is the listening (above, around, through, and under) for the movement of the Spirit...for we are just the vessels/containers in which the Holy works.<br /><br />Kudos to you for recognizing and searching out information which will aid in your healing. Blessings upon you.Elaine (aka...Purple) https://www.blogger.com/profile/09439199680556347830noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14710344.post-40279294358438722842011-06-08T07:20:08.195-04:002011-06-08T07:20:08.195-04:00How lovely and surprising to wake up and discover ...How lovely and surprising to wake up and discover a question about one of my favorite topics. Let's see whether I can discipline myself to write about spiritual direction a nutshell! I will leave the discussion of pastoral counseling to others.<br /><br />SD might be described as the ancient art of spiritual companionship. Its twin aims incorporate the deepening one's life of prayer and the sharpening one's capacity for discernment. Perhaps the most important aspect of the practice of SD is the recognition that the Spirit is always present and laboring as the third person in the conversation.<br /><br />SD is not so much about problem solving or life coaching (although those things tend to happen as well) as about growth in one's capacity and willingness to hear the voice of God and to become increasingly generous and available to God's desires for and invitations to us.<br /><br />As a SD, I see people who also see therapists, psychiatrists, pastoral counselors, grief counselors, their own pastors and priests, etc., for various reasons. SD tends to be the place in which they talk about their lives of prayer and in which they hope and expect to be encouraged and supported in opening their hearts and minds to God's movement in their lives.<br /><br />As someone who has been in SD for six years, including the last three of great trauma, I can say that it has completely changed my prayer, has made it possible for me to survive, in the most literal sense of that word, and also to change and grow tremendously in recognizing and responding to God.<br /><br />As far as the practical question of $$ is concerned, some people who come to see me pay nothing; most pay from $20-$50. When I was in a SD training program, our instructor saw payment as a matter of fairness and social justice. Most SDs invest a great deal of time and $$ in training and continuing education; in addition, those who are, for instance, members of religious communities, are expected to contribute earnings to the support of their communities. I have received a lot of SD for free, which I try in my small way to repay by being generous with my own time. My present director is a member of a religious order and a parish priest; I make a contribution to his order or parish church each month. <br /><br />I hope that this offers you some ways of thinking about what you want to do!Robinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01898073277524952683noreply@blogger.com